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fretz

console rebuild wish list

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That wood helm pod will look really good when done.  That adds a "classic" look to any boat.  I like that foot rest idea, too.  Overall, what you have mocked up so far looks good.  Just remember to have a little radius on all your corners as it will make it easier to glass.

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Fretz & Two N Tow

I did fiberglass RC racing Boat building for 27 years, here's a little trick you might wanna try, that helps keep any telegraphing  of cloth showing in your Gel Coats.

After you spray your Gelcoat and it cures, next spray a mist coat of just resin over it. You will not have any worry of telegraphing and it helps if in lay-up, if you get an air bubble between the cloth and gelcoat.    After the resin cures, you can then lay up an not have to worry about anything showing thru !

Designed the boats, built my own plugs and produced the boats for all 27 years...…      They had to be pretty to sell and that was a trick I learned from my fiberglass distributor...

 

Don    Dr. Ann  R-236

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That is a good trick to keep print through from happening.  Got any  pictures of the rc boats?

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Have to see if I can find any good pictures,  I had hundreds of them , but lost just about everything in Hurricane Katrina !   And to think,,,,,  I lived in a "NO FLOOD ZONE"  !!??

Here's 2 not too good pics I found, but I'll see if we have any more better one's somewhere.

The Mono hull (Oval Master Vee  Hull)  is 42 inches long, has a 90 motor (.90 cu. in. with a tuned pipe )  ran on 40% nitro fuel.  Red,White & Blue metal flake colors in the gel coat (No Decals). Average speed around the 1/3 rd mile oval course was 50-60 mph  (Actual mph )

The Hydro is one of the   Avenger Hydro's   (alias my e-mail address    a (avenger hydro)  s  (spider hydro )  boats   =  asboats    The Oval Master vee hulls came after I already had that address...…     The Avenger is a  80 Twin 44 inches long , 12 lbs.  (2- .80 cu. in. motors with tuned pipes )  ran 40% nitro fuel  70-80 mph,  avg. 60-70 mph around the oval course. 

The hydro's were all built out of  aircraft birch plywood, mostly 1/16"- 5 ply and 1/8"- 5 ply with 1/2" cedar hull sides, the cowling was made of fiberglass.

  Known as  Outrigger Hydro's, they were about 7 years further advanced than the BIG Hydro's like the Miss Budweisers and  Atlas Van lines  etc....      Scaled MPH for our hydro's would be like  300 MPH !!    Unlike like the big hydro's who had a small amt. of HP for their size and needed the lift of full decking, we had  a LARGE amount of Horse Power and a small amt of weight !!  So we needed to eliminate the lift of a full decking to keep them on the water..

Forced us to learn a LOT about  Hydrodynamics, Aerodynamics and Ground Effects...….

Once the BIG boats got some good horse power, (Turbine engines)  you started to see them moving more to our designs and removing decking.  Today, the New design in Drag Boats is our Outrigger design...….

 

Oval Master.jpg

Avenger Twin Hydro.jpg

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Those are some neat "toys", and I use that term very loosely.  The amount of money tied up in those is not just the cost of the boat and motor, but the time in getting the proper set-up to get to the point of kicking everybody else's butt!  Messing with those model boats also gave you a lot of insight on things to do to the Robalo and cut down on the "fear" of making changes to better suit your needs.  Glass work on those small boats is similar in a lot of ways to doing the same thing on our bigger boats.

How difficult was it driving those boats?  I would guess choppy water in the turns could be a hand full.  Were you making your own props for them or re-working somebody else's props.  Oh, and lets not forget that lovely smell of nitro/castor oil fuel being burned.  Just thinking of that smell brings back lots of childhood  memories when my dad raced alky hydros.

That was one thing we learned when designing and building race boats, too.  Lift could be your best friend and your worst enemy.  With tunnel boats, we tended to rely more on the tunnel for more of the lift than what the hydros did with their extended air traps running 3/4 the length of the bottom.  Since we did this on our own in the backyard in the 80's and 90's, we discovered that what one would expect to happen when compressing air in the tunnel actually worked opposite of what one would expect (ground effect 101).  You just had to find the right balance.

I don't know how much you may have followed the inboard hydro racing, but around the mid 90's (I think), a guy in the 2.5 litre class had a boat built very similar to the outrigger boats.  That boat was known as the Lobster Boat and ran darn good.  The designer realized the same thing you figured out...lift was drag; remove some of the lift and that loss drag turned into faster speed.  That boat opened a lot of eyes as it was so unconventional looking when it first appeared.

Thanks for sharing those pictures...I did not mean to de-rail this thread.

 

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No, let's don' forget   the Original thread, but your right in that a LOT of what I learned in those 27 years Directly applies to the real boats too !!

Driving at first for most seems to be simple,  UNTIL you were handed the Radio Control AND especially if you happened to run the boat back in YOUR direction , then most people panicked !! and lost all directionable ability.   The TRICK was to put yourself inside the boat (as if you were sitting inside the boat driving it)  that like magic, gave you the control ability back.

As for the Hydro's,  you can see the seriousness of that turn fin, which was also bent in towards the boat at an angle at eh riding  water line, which helped to keep it hooked in the water so you could put them full bore into a turn an not have it let loose an roll over.  HOWEVER, that bend line had to be correct or it would actually make the fin ride up out the water instead of holding down, an that would be detrimental.

As for propellers and engines,  I learned a heck of a lot about both, and worked my own propellers and motors.  It's AMAZING what you can make a propeller do with the right modifications !!   and that knowledge I also use to work my propellers on the Robalo !  

As for engines, they were two stroke motors  running Tuned Pipes.  I had a book which was invaluable in learning about both and how they operated, it was like my Bible.  I read that thing probably 5 times and referred to it many more.   It was all about how the two stroke motor worked and how to improve it and the why's about what you did. It also taught you how a tuned pipe worked, the affects of the two cones and the stinger at the end and what pipe length did.  TONS of knowledge.  These are the same types of motors and pipes racing motor bikes are running, except ours were water cooled.

A tuned pipe normally ran on two stages, but actually had three stages !!  Most people could not get to the third stage though.   I had a 20 size mono hull that I had worked to run thru the Straightaway Speed traps  and had set up the pipe back cone with a water spray injection inside the rear cone, to cool the back end of the pipe thereby adding a extra compression ratio to the back wave which forced more flow thru fuel back into the combustion chamber of the engine right before the exhaust window closed.....   When that boat got about 2/3rd's down the straightaway, that pipe kicked on the 3rd stage and blew the boat out of the water !!  It was like hitting the Nitro button for that Extra horsepower.....and you could hear the sound change when it did it.  Had to make some trim tab adjustments to keep the bow down for when that happened.....     Drawback to water injection was , you had to keep some power on an not slow the engine down to an idle or the water filled that back end of the pipe too much an killed the engine....

Used that set up on a 20 size hydro for straightaway speed trials thru the traps and actually captured a World Record for a while.....   Maybe somebody on the site belonged to the International group I did , it was a world organization called  IMPBA   (International Model Power Boat Association)  I traveled around the US to race and my local club had several BIG races a year in which we had people from  all over attend even one's from out of the country.

OK  let's don't forget about helping Fretz,,   cause I could go on for days with this stuff, it was a fun and  27 year learning experience that I still use...

 

Don

 

 

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I may have to resurrect my boat racing thread so we can have some fun!

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AADBE725-02D0-47F8-BB67-046E64937FEA.jpeg

this is my mold...

Ill fille the screw holes and corners with bondo and then coat with a few coats of mold release wax.

the plan is to make it about 1" over size grind the edges and then use fiberglass tape to secure it in place when were done.  

 

 

0A68A6CB-D9A5-4A32-AFBD-02249375F99D.jpeg

Edited by fretz
adding text

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Doing good.

A trick for using bondo to make a filet inside corner.  First figure out what you will use for the filet shape.  PVC pipe works great and is cheap.  Mark on your mold about a 1/4" wider on both pieces than the pvc contact points, then run some painters tape along that line to catch any excess bondo.  Mix up the bondo, the  put it in a plastic sandwich bag in the bottom corner.  Twist the bag like a pastry bag so all the bondo is down in the corner.  Cut the corner of the bag and then  you have much better control laying down a bead of bondo versus pushing it in there with a putty  knife or squeege.  Then use the piece of pvc pipe to get the final shape of the filet.  Once it starts to set, remove the tape and you should have very little sanding to do to finish it off.

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Progress is never fast enough!

54C43BCD-AAB3-4A4D-90CC-D721DB9BFBB9.jpeg

waxed up and ready for glass

 

7339D264-857E-4064-AB79-75061DAAA0F8.jpeg

3 layers of chop strand 2 layers of mat and a final layer of chop strand 

 

4AAB0A08-07A4-4C3C-865A-BBAB4C0D9A60.jpeg

taped in from the underside

13BC6F5E-2230-4AE1-B6C0-A4E6EBE64559.jpeg

I still need to tape the seams from above

 

39055C4E-61D7-43C3-BF5C-6E91E387323C.jpeg

Put my helm pod back on to confirm it still fits.  still considering if the gps should be middle with the gauges on the left or center the gps on the wheel and put the gauges in the middle.

8B13D543-E31F-47F6-BBB9-A6CF489F3A13.jpeg

This is the teak i will use for the helm pod.  Now i just need to repair my Jointer and make sure all my fences are true.  See you in a few weeks!

 

Edited by fretz

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Looks good!

Regarding the gps, place it directly in your sight line behind the steering wheel.  LCD displays do not look as sharp when viewed from an angle.  Something about how the pixels are arranged and also the anti-glare screen surface.  This is speaking from experience, by the way.  I have a 10 inch Garmin MFD directly behind the wheel and the image is great.  I also have an older Furuno bottom machine off the side of the MFD, and it is nowhere as bright as the Garmin unless I move so I am directly in front of it.  Analog gauges can be viewed from any angle, so they can be mounted off to the side.

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3DC2CF31-E064-409B-AEB8-24DFC5390591.jpeg

2 coats of gelcoat.  i also bonded a piece of ply on the inside of the console to hold electronics etc..

 

8FB95D4C-420C-4169-B28C-A9C1F216946C.jpeg

teak cut for the pod.  

 

6F4D7578-3B5C-4B0E-8C21-44AC933C74C0.jpeg

1st glue up

 

165E3332-47F2-49C8-9A9A-425F7323CBFA.jpeg

cut so the grain flows from one piece to another

you can see the sides here for a dry fit before gluing up

 

5BB3FED7-BA24-49ED-8C4E-134759184B85.jpeg

after glue up ill round the edge with a 3/4 bit in the router table

 

AF5C6C25-A092-4AA3-8647-F98E089DE98A.jpeg

2nd glue up for the sides.  

 

AC15EDCE-DD04-4D4D-88C0-3A025F4CF61C.jpeg

 

1st coat of varnish on the old trim in probably 15 years.

Edited by fretz
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Making progress and what you have done so far looks good.  Is that plywood inside the console encapsulated in fiberglass cloth?  If not, try to get one layer on it to keep any moisture out of it and cause issues years down the road.  I would hate to see all that good work have to be re-done some due to that one piece of wood.

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Yes the ply is covered in glass. I wanted something solid to mount electronics too behind the dash.  

Cleaned up my glue  joints, ran the edges through the router table and got a coat of varnish on.  Only 20 coats to go!

 

 

C0F6C3A0-902C-4259-B63C-5CA74E78F436.jpeg

C797071F-AA93-4B76-8A8B-2C8FD58B9078.jpeg

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Nice how you matched the grain between the front and top pieces.

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FA72F441-9DDF-4DBD-B204-455FDA919B32.jpeg

AEAA74C1-9E42-438D-B47C-37C9AC14AF32.jpeg

Going with the gps centered on the wheel. Just ordered a piece of black acrylic for the panel. 

Still have to prime and paint... gelcoat isn’t cutting it.  tic toc goes the Memorial Day clock!

Edited by fretz
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Gelcoat can be a challenge!  Sometimes I can get it to work out fine with a mold, other times I end up sanding it and then spraying gelcoat thinned with Duratec gelcoat gloss additive.

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